Months after it became the hottest topic in British rugby, Immanuel Feyi-Waboso is discussing his heritage and the multi-national family background which explains his decision to represent England.
It is complex and the 21-year-old Exeter wing sensation is uneasy about how to summarise it all. 'I don't want to get it wrong,' he joked, after being asked about his grandad's relocation from Nigeria.
'I know he came over and met my English grandma (Margaret Spence Taylor) in Cheltenham and she went over to Nigeria for a bit,' he said. 'My dad, his brothers and sisters were educated in Nigeria. My dad went to uni in Ibadan (in Nigeria) then came over. I had a UK up-bringing, but it was very Nigerian in the house; the food, culture, the religion.
'My grandad is dead, so I never met him. I haven't spoken to my grandma about it too much, but you guys have sparked my interest! I should know a bit more.'
So, that is how it all began, but that's not the full picture. It turns out that Feyi-Waboso has relatives spread across three different continents.
Immanuel Feyi-Waboso's decision to snub Wales for England became a hot topic in rugby
Feyi-Waboso (second from left) clarified why he felt an allegiance to England instead of Wales
'My mum is Nigerian,' he added. 'She was living here, but her mum is Jamaican, her dad is Nigerian and everyone on that side lives in America; my aunties and uncles. One auntie still lives in Nigeria, but the rest are in California, one uncle in Alabama, one in Virginia – scattered all over. Dad's side is all Nigerian but living in England.'
This clarification provides vital context. It shows why a talented rookie who was born and raised in Cardiff felt a strong allegiance to England, rather than Wales. 'All my dad's side are English and even when I was younger and playing in Wales, they were like, "You're going to play for England"', said Feyi-Waboso. 'It's funny how things turn out. They were all super happy I was playing for England (in the Six Nations). My cousins got to meet Maro and Ellis Genge, so were really happy with that.'
However, the choice made by the young Chief back in January – when he told Steve Borthwick that he would accept a call-up to the Red Rose squad – was not only based on family ties, which weren't immediately apparent. It was also about showing loyalty to the country which provided the chance to properly pursue a rugby career.
'I do have a strong affinity to play for England,' said Feyi-Waboso. 'Over the past couple of years, I've lived here – and England have given me a lot of opportunities and education. I was at Clifton College for a time, and Aston University gave me an opportunity, then Exeter gave me an opportunity when Wasps went down. England have just been there the whole time and have always been good to me. I have family here, and my development as a rugby player has been here.'
As a relative newcomer in the professional game, he was shocked to be the subject of such scrutiny and debate – which was a reflection of the remarkable impact he had made in a short time in the Exeter side. 'I didn't expect people to be so interested,' said Feyi-Waboso.
The young Exeter Chiefs wing wanted to show loyalty to the country which gave him a chance
But as a relative newcomer, he was shocked to be the subject of such scrutiny and debate
'It was a decision I was going to make, but I didn't expect everyone to care so much. In the end, I'm super happy with my decision. Playing for England is a massive privilege and honour. It's amazing. Being in Twickenham is crazy.
'In the Six Nations, Wales did not do as well and for me as a rugby player, England was definitely the choice I wanted to make. There are people (including Warren Gatland) who say the turn-over of wings is high and there's a bigger pool of players, but you just have to back yourself.'
During the Six Nations, Feyi-Waboso captured the imagination of the English rugby public and his team-mates too. Others in Borthwick's squad spoke with admiration about how well he was doing after such a turbulent journey to the pinnacle of the sport.
First, the medical student was rejected by Cardiff University, which meant moving across the border, then he had to find another club when Wasps suffered their financial collapse 18 months ago. He has shown remarkable resilience.
Reflecting on the sudden upheavals he has had to endure, Feyi-Waboso said: 'None of them were smooth or anticipated. The plan was to go to Cardiff Uni, do a part-time course and continue with Cardiff Rugby.
During the Six Nations, Feyi-Waboso captured the imagination of the English rugby public
'I didn't get into Cardiff Uni, so I was like, "What do I do now?". I moved to Aston in Birmingham and the closest club was Wasps. I was just trying to establish myself in that (academy) squad and playing for Stourbridge. Then, just as I was about to break into that Wasps team, they went down (out of business).
'With that next transition, I spoke to Rob (Baxter – Exeter's director of rugby) and he helped me out massively. I would have been left without a club, but he said they had a great connection with the uni. I said, "I've heard that before". Cardiff had said that. I still wanted to do medicine. Rob and the uni made it happen.'
Given his family's medical credentials, it is no surprise that Feyi-Waboso was determined to pursue that career path, as well as making the most of his oval-ball talent. 'I don't know if I was nudged into medicine sub-consciously, but it's always something I've wanted to do,' he added.
'My brother is a doctor. He's five years older than me. He went to Exeter Uni. It's weird how we've come here and done the same thing. My dad is a doctor, an ophthalmologist, and my grandad was a gynaecologist. My uncle is a doctor, my auntie is an optician. It was inevitable, I guess!'
After his impressive first start for England culminated in a momentous win over Grand Slam-chasing Ireland at Twickenham, Feyi-Waboso was said to have sensibly stood himself down after developing concussion symptoms, meaning he missed the championship finale against France in Lyon. He laughed at the suggestion that it was a self-diagnosis, but he had enough maturity to report the symptoms and accept that it meant he had to withdraw.
Feyi-Waboso missed the showdown against France after developing concussion symptoms
'I would have loved to play against France,' he said. 'The atmosphere looked crazy and it was an unbelievable game. I was watching at home – in uni halls, on campus. It was an abrupt end to the camp for me, but I enjoyed it so much. It was tough watching that France game back at uni, after the high of that game against Ireland.'
That hadn't been the only high. Feyi-Waboso had come off the bench at Murrayfield to score his first Test try in the defeat against Scotland. It was an early indication of his predatory instincts. 'When you look up and see what is in front of you, then your body just takes over,' said the deadly runner.
'That try was very much in the moment. I saw two people (defenders) vacate and it was a three on two. It was loud, so I don't know how Spenno (Ben Spencer) heard me, but I was like "ball up, ball up, ball up", he found me, and I was straight through.
'It was a huge moment for me. Massive. But in the moment, the stadium was so quiet. I thought, "Did I even score?". It didn't feel real.'
So much of what has happened to him barely feels real, given the rapid turn of events. Rewind a few months and Feyi-Waboso was still trying to become a fixture in the Exeter side. Now he is being lauded as a poster-boy for England's brave new world of attacking ambition. He is still trying to get his head around the status change.
Now, Feyi-Waboso is being lauded as a poster-boy for England's brave new world of ambition
'It's been a quick transition,' he said. 'You say I'm a Test player, but I feel like I still have a long way to go to be a proper Test player. I wouldn't call myself a Test player yet. I'm not even an established Premiership player, really. I haven't played at Saracens yet!'
That will surely happen soon, especially if Exeter win at Sale, to take another step towards the Premiership play-offs, before trying to reach the last eight of the Champions Cup. When the club season is over, Feyi-Waboso will be able to wrap up his medical tasks, ready to join England's crusade to Japan and New Zealand.
'My last written exam is June 10 and the first tour game is on the 22nd,' he said. Hopefully, I will get it done, so I can focus on my rugby.'
For someone who is not giving the sport his undivided attention, he is having quite some impact. 'The world is his oyster,' said Baxter.
That is undoubtedly true.